Gavel tapping

[Clay Rembert]

Hi,

There appears to be conflicting statements as to the proper way to use the gavel.  So the question is, where in the 11th edition can we find the specific guidance on when, what it means, and how many times to tap the gavel during various sections of our meetings.  Thanks in advance!   

[Alexis Hunt]

Check your index. RONR only advises the use of a gavel when recessing or adjourning the meeting, and is otherwise silent except to warn against the use of the gavel to drown out or ignore members.

[Josh Martin]

23 minutes ago, ClayRembert said:

There appears to be conflicting statements as to the proper way to use the gavel.  

Which statements do you think are in conflict on this matter? Not statements in RONR, I hope.

23 minutes ago, ClayRembert said:

So the question is, where in the 11th edition can we find the specific guidance on when, what it means, and how many times to tap the gavel during various sections of our meetings. 

The gavel is used when when declaring a recess or adjournment and when calling a member to order. In all of these cases, one rap of the gavel is sufficient. It is also sometimes used for ceremonial purposes , such as installing officers.

See RONR, 11th ed., pgs. 232, 242, 387, 629, 645

I had thought previously that RONR also said to use the gavel to call a meeting to order, but I can’t find that now, so I may have been mistaken.

[Guest Zev]

1 hour ago, Josh Martin said:

I had thought previously that RONR also said to use the gavel to call a meeting to order, but I can’t find that now, so I may have been mistaken.

"I made one mistake. I thought I was wrong, but was I was right."

The reference about striking the gavel to signal the start of a meeting existed only in editions 4, 5, and 6, in paragraph 71, page 293.

[Joshua Katz]

In the Georgia Court of Appeals, the Chief Judge has a giant gavel, somewhat bigger than an average-sized person. It is not used regularly. In the Supreme Court, only the Marshal has a gavel and it is very rarely used.

[Rob Elsman]

If one is to be used at all, please place the sounding board where the sound system won't pick up the whack and blast it through the meeting hall like an artillery piece going off.

[Clay Rembert]

Mega thanks for the feedback!  Josh, ironically, the most recent conflicting statement is found in the online course provided by NAP Education-What to Say and When V2. The course catalog (resource script) specifically states the President will "rap gavel once" and the  meeting will come to order.  Additionally, I've view various online training that says "rap twice"...However, it's appears that some training is still using an earlier edition.  I also notice that the verbiage "if desired" is used in the Form and Example of RONR , so I will avoid using it in the future...thanks again!

[Gary Novosielski]

Dang, I would always rap it exactly three times when calling the meeting to order.

I'm sure someone will assert that this invalidates everything that was decided at those meetings.  ☺️

[Guest Zev]

Invalidated? Not really. You inadvertently closed the meeting with the second rap and reopened it with the third. You are a lucky man. Next time make sure its always an odd number of raps.

[Gary Novosielski]

On 6/30/2019 at 7:14 PM, Guest Zev said:

Invalidated? Not really. You inadvertently closed the meeting with the second rap and reopened it with the third. You are a lucky man. Next time make sure its always an odd number of raps.

It might be better for a number of reasons if the second rap was considered to recess the meeting until called to order by the chair (which would follow immediately). If nothing else it would eliminate the need for another set of minutes.

 . . .

Now, having said that, I've done some digging and discovered a problem: While the Form and Example for Recess says that a rap of the gavel is allowed, the same is not true for reconvening afterwards.  It does say that the chair gains the attention of the assembly, and I can think of no better way to do that than with a rap of the gavel, but RONR either disagrees or does not take a position.  It does appeal to my sense of symmetry.

My apologies if this should have been posted in the Tomfoolery section. 🙂

Edited July 3, 2019 at 03:52 PM by Gary Novosielski
grammar

[Richard Brown]

I'm glad to know the language about rapping the gavel once to call the meeting to order did appear in earlier editions!  Like Josh Martin, I knew I had seen it in there somewhere!   It also seems logical to use the gavel to call the meeting to order.  Why use it to call a member to order and to announce a recess or adjournment, but not to call the meeting to order?  Doesn't make sense.  And it's not symmetrical. 

[Gary Novosielski]

7 minutes ago, Richard Brown said:

I'm glad to know the language about rapping the gavel once to call the meeting to order did appear in earlier editions!  Like Josh Martin, I knew I had seen it in there somewhere!   It also seems logical to use the gavel to call the meeting to order.  Why use it to call a member to order and to announce a recess or adjournment, but not to call the meeting to order?  Doesn't make sense.  And it's not symmetrical. 

I agree completely.

I'm looking at you, twelfth edition.

[Guest markfromlegal]

I tend to take a 3-2-1 approach to "gavel craft," i.e., the consistent, predictable use of a gavel in the punctuation of a meeting's major points.

Meeting Focused [3 raps, with gravitas] - to open a meeting or call a meeting back to order after a recess or session to session adjournment (in the case of a multi-day meeting).

Member Focused [2 raps, quick] - to punctuate the end of a speaker's limited time, punctuate the end of debate time, or to quickly call a member to order/generally call for order in the case of commotion.

Motion Focused [1 rap] - to punctuate major meeting transactions, i.e., the body's vote on a motion ("With a vote of X to Y with Z abstentions, the motion fails." [raps gavel once])

 

[Gary Novosielski]

On 10/2/2023 at 1:25 PM, Guest markfromlegal said:

I tend to take a 3-2-1 approach to "gavel craft," i.e., the consistent, predictable use of a gavel in the punctuation of a meeting's major points.

Meeting Focused [3 raps, with gravitas] - to open a meeting or call a meeting back to order after a recess or session to session adjournment (in the case of a multi-day meeting).

Member Focused [2 raps, quick] - to punctuate the end of a speaker's limited time, punctuate the end of debate time, or to quickly call a member to order/generally call for order in the case of commotion.

Motion Focused [1 rap] - to punctuate major meeting transactions, i.e., the body's vote on a motion ("With a vote of X to Y with Z abstentions, the motion fails." [raps gavel once])

 

That sounds like overuse.  The only time I'd use the gavel to punctuate a transaction is the motion to Adjourn.

And abstentions should not be called for, counted, or reported as votes.  They are not votes.  And there's virtually no way to count them, since a person who does not respond at all to a call for abstentions has still abstained.

[Rob Elsman]

I think this topic is dead and should be buried.

[Gary Novosielski]

I've seen deader. 😵

[Gary Novosielski]

Besides markfromlegal left out the one essential way to prove that you are the kewlest gavelator ever:  Grabbing the gavel by the big end, and tapping with the end of the handle.  You tap once, twice, or thrice, depending upon how kewl you need to appear in the existing parliamentary situation.

[Josh Martin]

On 10/2/2023 at 12:25 PM, Guest markfromlegal said:

I tend to take a 3-2-1 approach to "gavel craft," i.e., the consistent, predictable use of a gavel in the punctuation of a meeting's major points.

Meeting Focused [3 raps, with gravitas] - to open a meeting or call a meeting back to order after a recess or session to session adjournment (in the case of a multi-day meeting).

Member Focused [2 raps, quick] - to punctuate the end of a speaker's limited time, punctuate the end of debate time, or to quickly call a member to order/generally call for order in the case of commotion.

Motion Focused [1 rap] - to punctuate major meeting transactions, i.e., the body's vote on a motion ("With a vote of X to Y with Z abstentions, the motion fails." [raps gavel once])

This is far too much gavel so far as RONR is concerned.

As has been previously noted, RONR provides that the gavel is used when when declaring a recess or adjournment and when calling a member to order. In all of these cases, one rap of the gavel is sufficient. It is also sometimes used for ceremonial purposes , such as installing officers. I don't particularly object to also using the gavel to also call the meeting to order, but again, one rap is plenty.

The purpose of the gavel is not to be a "consistent, predictable use... in the punctuation of a meeting's major points." The gavel is supposed to be used sparingly, so that when it is used, it gets the assembly's attention. If the gavel is used constantly, such as after votes on a motion or to punctuate the end of debate, members will quickly start to drown it out.