Angie N Posted August 24, 2021 at 12:37 PM Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 12:37 PM Hello, I am seeking some guidance regarding suspension of bylaws. Our HOA says special meeting can be held with 4 days notice. An emergency come up and the president wants to have the special meeting without the 4 days notice. He said that we can meet, suspend the bylaws and have the meeting. Is this accurate? Can the bylaws be suspended? If not, is there a way to still have this meeting without violating the bylaws? Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted August 24, 2021 at 12:41 PM Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 12:41 PM (edited) 4 minutes ago, Angie N said: He said that we can meet, suspend the bylaws and have the meeting. Is this accurate? Can the bylaws be suspended? No, unless there are no absentees. (see below) 4 minutes ago, Angie N said: If not, is there a way to still have this meeting without violating the bylaws? The rule in question protects absentees, if there are any. Therefore literally every member entitled to attend would need to be present. Otherwise, no. Edited August 24, 2021 at 12:43 PM by George Mervosh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Katz Posted August 24, 2021 at 12:42 PM Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 12:42 PM (edited) No. Certain bylaw provisions may be suspended - those in the nature of rules of order, and those that provide for their own suspension. This is neither, unless your bylaws provide for a suspension. There is nothing you can do to get around the 4 day notice requirement. It's there to specifically protect against holding meetings without notice. There's no trick to get out of it. Perhaps your board can act on the emergency, if it has a different rule? Edited to add: I forgot the possibility of full attendance. That will suffice. Edited August 24, 2021 at 12:43 PM by Joshua Katz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angie N Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:03 PM Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:03 PM 17 minutes ago, Joshua Katz said: No. Certain bylaw provisions may be suspended - those in the nature of rules of order, and those that provide for their own suspension. This is neither, unless your bylaws provide for a suspension. Would you be able to share the RONR reference? Also this is what the bylaws say about suspension. Does this change anything? Would the notice fall under business procedure? No Bylaws shall be changed except by a vote of one-third of the members voting, a quorum being present. Bylaws relating to business procedure, transaction of business, rules of order and other standing rules not requiring a ballot vote may be suspended Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angie N Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:04 PM Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:04 PM 21 minutes ago, George Mervosh said: The rule in question protects absentees, if there are any. Therefore literally every member entitled to attend would need to be present. Otherwise, no. Is there a RONR reference you can share? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:06 PM Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:06 PM 1 minute ago, Angie N said: Is there a RONR reference you can share? RONR (12th ed.), 25:10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Honemann Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:13 PM Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:13 PM 8 minutes ago, Angie N said: Would you be able to share the RONR reference? Also this is what the bylaws say about suspension. Does this change anything? Would the notice fall under business procedure? No Bylaws shall be changed except by a vote of one-third of the members voting, a quorum being present. Bylaws relating to business procedure, transaction of business, rules of order and other standing rules not requiring a ballot vote may be suspended You sure it doesn't say two-thirds? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angie N Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:14 PM Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:14 PM Just now, Daniel H. Honemann said: You sure it doesn't say two-thirds? I am sure. I copied and pasted it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angie N Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:17 PM Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:17 PM 8 minutes ago, George Mervosh said: RONR (12th ed.), 25:10 Thank you! Would you be able to answer if what our bylaws say about suspension change anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:19 PM Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:19 PM 1 minute ago, Angie N said: Thank you! Would you be able to answer if what our bylaws say about suspension change anything? No, I'm sorry. Interpreting bylaws is something we are supposed to strictly avoid around here unless we want to incur The Wrath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angie N Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:21 PM Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 01:21 PM 1 minute ago, George Mervosh said: No, I'm sorry. Interpreting bylaws is something we are supposed to strictly avoid around here unless we want to incur The Wrath. Thank you! I appreciate your responses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atul Kapur Posted August 24, 2021 at 04:25 PM Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 04:25 PM Wait, wait, Come Back @Angie N! 3 hours ago, Angie N said: No Bylaws shall be changed except by a vote of one-third of the members voting, a quorum being present. So one-third of your members voting can change your bylaws? So if 35 vote in favour of an amendment and 65 vote against, the amendment is adopted?? Is that really how your HOA has been proceeding??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Elsman Posted August 24, 2021 at 05:14 PM Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 05:14 PM Wow! One-third. I have never heard of that. At any rate, a main motion to suspend the notice requirement in the bylaw would be an improper main motion under the rule at RONR (12th ed.) 10:26, item (1), where the relevant footnote does not apply to this case. Such a motion would not be in order, regardless what the chair would like to think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angie N Posted August 24, 2021 at 06:16 PM Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 06:16 PM 1 hour ago, Atul Kapur said: Wait, wait, Come Back @Angie N! So one-third of your members voting can change your bylaws? So if 35 vote in favour of an amendment and 65 vote against, the amendment is adopted?? Is that really how your HOA has been proceeding??? Lol! I am back now. Yes that is what our Bylaws say. I copied and pasted them as written. I can not speak on how long they have been this way. The amendments used to be the same as well, 1/3. They were changed about 3 years ago to 2/3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angie N Posted August 24, 2021 at 06:17 PM Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 06:17 PM 1 hour ago, Rob Elsman said: Wow! One-third. I have never heard of that. At any rate, a main motion to suspend the notice requirement in the bylaw would be an improper main motion under the rule at RONR (12th ed.) 10:26, item (1), where the relevant footnote does not apply to this case. Such a motion would not be in order, regardless what the chair would like to think. Thank you! I appreciate your response and RONR reference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atul Kapur Posted August 24, 2021 at 08:26 PM Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 08:26 PM 2 hours ago, Angie N said: Lol! I am back now. Yes that is what our Bylaws say. I copied and pasted them as written. I can not speak on how long they have been this way. The amendments used to be the same as well, 1/3. They were changed about 3 years ago to 2/3. Your copy and paste said that a change to the bylaws requires 1/3. Here you say amendments also used to say 1/3 but now say 2/3. I don't understand the diffference between "change" and "amendment" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angie N Posted August 24, 2021 at 08:46 PM Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2021 at 08:46 PM On 8/24/2021 at 4:26 PM, Atul Kapur said: Your copy and paste said that a change to the bylaws requires 1/3. Here you say amendments also used to say 1/3 but now say 2/3. I don't understand the diffference between "change" and "amendment" There are 2 different sections of our Bylaws that I am referring to. What I copied and pasted was a section called "Suspension of Bylaws". There is another section called "Amendment of Bylaws". That also had 1/3 until 3 years as previously mentioned now it is 2/3. I hope this helps address your question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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