opinions as part of minutes

[Guest Abby]

Can any board member, at any time during a board meeting, stipulate that he/she wants their opinion to be on record as part of the minutes?

[Dan Honemann]

Can any board member, at any time during a board meeting, stipulate that he/she wants their opinion to be on record as part of the minutes?

Stipulate? What do you mean by that?

[Guest Leah]

Normally (my interpretation anyway), it's actions and a summary of discussions that are recorded on the minutes. But if a board member wants his/her opinion on the record in the minutes, is it allowed?

[Guest dan]

The RONR answer is that the minutes should reflect what was done, and not what was said - either in detail or in summary.

Your rules may vary.

[Dan Honemann]

Normally (my interpretation anyway), it's actions and a summary of discussions that are recorded on the minutes. But if a board member wants his/her opinion on the record in the minutes, is it allowed?

A "summary of discussions" should not be recorded in the minutes.

[Rev Ed]

If a Board member disagrees with a decision that has been made by the Board, he/she should request that a statement to that effect be placed in the Minutes. Other then that, debate/discussion should not be entered into the Minutes. Some organizations, however, will create a standing order that the rationale for a decision be placed into the Minutes. For example, should the Board pass a motion to repair a 20 year old roof on the clubhouse, a statement after the Motion along the line of "The Board decided that the clubhouse's roof was to be replaced as it was 20 years old" may be entered into the Minutes for reference in the future.

[Guest Leah]

For example, I have found problems with how our condo board meetings are run. The board chair is far from unbiased, decisions are being made based on little or no criteria or procedure, residents are not being listened to,etc., and I wanted it on the record (for the benefit of all residents) as to what was happening. If I were to put something in writing, I couldn't have it attached to the minutes? How else would the residents know what was going on otherwise? Maybe this is beyond the scope of this forum, but it's rather frustrating.

[George Mervosh]

Ed should/could have stopped after his second sentence.

[hmtcastle]

How else would the residents know what was going on otherwise?

Why not just tell them?

As we never tire of saying here, the minutes are the official record of what was done at a meeting (e.g. motions), not what was said (e.g. debate). They are not intended as a substitute for actually attending the meeting, nor are they the place to record reports, letters, etc.

If you're a member of the board, make a point of order at the next meeting citing the rules you think the chair is breaking. If you're not a member of the board, find a friendly board member to do it.

If you think it might be time for a new board chair, see FAQ #20.

[Tim Wynn]

Ed should/could have stopped after his second sentence.

... or two earlier. I don't think it's a good idea to clutter the minutes with opinions.

[Tim Wynn]

For example, I have found problems with how our condo board meetings are run. The board chair is far from unbiased, decisions are being made based on little or no criteria or procedure, residents are not being listened to,etc.,

If you're a board member, raise a point of order when a rule is violated. If you're not a board member, you have no right to participate. The board doesn't have to listen to individual nonmembers of the board, though it does have to comply with directives from the parent body (the general membership).

and I wanted it on the record (for the benefit of all residents) as to what was happening. If I were to put something in writing, I couldn't have it attached to the minutes? How else would the residents know what was going on otherwise? Maybe this is beyond the scope of this forum, but it's rather frustrating.

The minutes are only accessible to the members of the board, not the general membership. Even if the minutes are provided to the general membership, they're not a forum for your observations and opinions.

Talk is cheap. Take action. If the board is breaking the rules, if the chair is negligent in his duties, make the appropriate motions at the next general membership meeting.

[Guest dan]

For example, I have found problems with how our condo board meetings are run. The board chair is far from unbiased, decisions are being made based on little or no criteria or procedure, residents are not being listened to,etc., and I wanted it on the record (for the benefit of all residents) as to what was happening. If I were to put something in writing, I couldn't have it attached to the minutes? How else would the residents know what was going on otherwise? Maybe this is beyond the scope of this forum, but it's rather frustrating.

One possible way for something to be "on record" is for a member of that body to make a motion such that the motion communicates the issue at hand.

Perhaps a motion to hold a residents forum to listen to what residents have on their mind would do the trick.

Another way is to run (and campaign) for a position on the condo board. Challenge the incumbent to a public debate on the issues of how the board is run, and how decisions are made.

[Rob Elsman]

If a Board member disagrees with a decision that has been made by the Board, he/she should request that a statement to that effect be placed in the Minutes. Other then that, debate/discussion should not be entered into the Minutes. Some organizations, however, will create a standing order that the rationale for a decision be placed into the Minutes. For example, should the Board pass a motion to repair a 20 year old roof on the clubhouse, a statement after the Motion along the line of "The Board decided that the clubhouse's roof was to be replaced as it was 20 years old" may be entered into the Minutes for reference in the future.

I disagree with this whole reply. Little or nothing about it agrees with what is said about the contents of the minutes in RONR (10th ed.), pp. 451-454. The request spoken of is dilatory and out of order, and nothing in parliamentary law requires members to agree on the reason for adopting a particular motion.

[Gary Novosielski]

If a Board member disagrees with a decision that has been made by the Board, he/she should request that a statement to that effect be placed in the Minutes.

No, he/she should not.

Where are you getting that from?

[Gary Novosielski]

Ed should/could have stopped after his second sentence.

I think he should have stopped just before his first sentence.

[Rev Ed]

No, he/she should not.

Where are you getting that from?

I was told once by a lawyer that if a director has legitmate concerns about a decision made by the Board, that he/she should request that his/her objection should be either Minuted or placed in a letter to other Board members. I was informed that altough the entire Board can be held accountable for decisions that the Board made, that if a director can document (either by letter or in the Minutes) that he/she disagreed with a decision that the the director would likely not be held liable, or at least be held less liable.

Of course, it would be better to simply request a recorded vote, per RONR, but there is nothing wrong with the objection being placed into the Minutes at the end of the day.

[Rob Elsman]

I was told once by a lawyer that if a director has legitmate concerns about a decision made by the Board, that he/she should request that his/her objection should be either Minuted or placed in a letter to other Board members. I was informed that altough the entire Board can be held accountable for decisions that the Board made, that if a director can document (either by letter or in the Minutes) that he/she disagreed with a decision that the the director would likely not be held liable, or at least be held less liable.

Of course, it would be better to simply request a recorded vote, per RONR, but there is nothing wrong with the objection being placed into the Minutes at the end of the day.

But, of course, none of this has anything to do with the general parliamentary law embodied in RONR (10th ed.).

[J. J.]

A member may request nearly anything, including putting some statement in the minutes. The majority could permit it, or not.

[Telephonics]

For example, I have found problems with how our condo board meetings are run. The board chair is far from unbiased, decisions are being made based on little or no criteria or procedure, residents are not being listened to,etc., and I wanted it on the record (for the benefit of all residents) as to what was happening. If I were to put something in writing, I couldn't have it attached to the minutes? How else would the residents know what was going on otherwise? Maybe this is beyond the scope of this forum, but it's rather frustrating.

[Gary Novosielski]

I was told once by a lawyer that if a director has legitmate concerns about a decision made by the Board, that he/she should request that his/her objection should be either Minuted or placed in a letter to other Board members. I was informed that altough the entire Board can be held accountable for decisions that the Board made, that if a director can document (either by letter or in the Minutes) that he/she disagreed with a decision that the the director would likely not be held liable, or at least be held less liable.

Of course, it would be better to simply request a recorded vote, per RONR, but there is nothing wrong with the objection being placed into the Minutes at the end of the day.

..but, one hopes, prior to adjournment.

Anyway, that's a far cry from one who simply "disagrees" with a decision, which is what your original statement was.

Now, if a member has a good-faith belief that a motion is so inappropriate that it would expose those voting in the affirmative to legal liability or other unspeakable mischief, he might be well advised to Object to Consideration. Or, if the problem only becomes apparent after debate has begun, he might raise a Point of Order that the motion is not in order and, if not upheld, to Appeal from the Decision of the Chair. Not only would this ensure that the nature of his objection was recorded in the minutes, but it would also be evidence that he had done all he could, procedurally, to stop the motion, rather than simply casting a No vote, and stating his opposition "for the record."

In other words, if you're concerned about liability, drive defensively.

[Josh Martin]

Now, if a member has a good-faith belief that a motion is so inappropriate that it would expose those voting in the affirmative to legal liability or other unspeakable mischief...

In other words, if you're concerned about liability, drive defensively.

Or better yet, if you're concerned about liability, consult a lawyer.

[Gary Novosielski]

Or better yet, if you're concerned about liability, consult a lawyer.

Well, he said he had already done that, so maybe I'll add "consult a better one."