voting by ballot

[Guest Froggie]

Our bylaws state: "Voting on all matt4ers shall be by voice vote or by show of hands unless any Member, prior to the voting on any matter, demands a written vote."

Is that demand for a written vote subject to a vote by the membership, or does that one person's request immediately mean that the wishes of one person are compelled to be followed by the entire membership (which at the upcoming meeting will probably be around 100 persons?

[George Mervosh]

Our bylaws state: "Voting on all matt4ers shall be by voice vote or by show of hands unless any Member, prior to the voting on any matter, demands a written vote."

Is that demand for a written vote subject to a vote by the membership, or does that one person's request immediately mean that the wishes of one person are compelled to be followed by the entire membership (which at the upcoming meeting will probably be around 100 persons?

 

When RONR says one person can demand something the assembly is then subject to the nature of that one person's demand, without a vote.  What has been your past practice regarding this provision?

[Guest froggie]

I don't think we have had this issue come up before, so we don't have a past practice.

 

[Richard Brown]

I don't think we have had this issue come up before, so we don't have a past practice.

I agree with George.  Based on the rules and explanations in RONR, I believe a rule in your bylaws that says, in essence, that one member may demand a written (ballot) vote, means just what it says:  One member may demand a written vote and that is that.  It says what it means and means what it says.

[Kim Goldsworthy]

Our bylaws state:

"Voting on all matters shall be by voice vote or by show of hands unless any Member, prior to the voting on any matter, demands a written vote."

>> Is that demand for a written vote subject to a vote by the membership? <<

 

No.

Else, the rule would have said,

". . . unless the assembly [or "members present", or "delgates", etc.], prior to the voting on any matter, demands a written vote."

 

You don't need a rule like your to authorize a member to make a motion, 'That we vote by ballot'.

You always have that, under the default rules of Robert's Rules of Order.

[Bruce Lages]

Guest Froggie -

 

Amplifying a little bit on what Mr. Goldsworthy said - unless you actually want a single member to be able to force a vote by ballot there is no reason to have such a statement in your bylaws at all if your organization has adopted RONR as your parliamentary authority. RONR gives you the default method of a voice vote (or a vote by show of hands if  that's what the assembly prefers) and several options for counted votes including a division of the assembly at the demand of a single member, and voting by ballot via motion and majority vote.

[Edgar Guest]

 . . . unless you actually want a single member to be able to force a vote by ballot there is no reason to have such a statement in your bylaws at all . . 

 

And, if you do, you might want to change "written vote" to "ballot vote".

[Josh Martin]

Our bylaws state: "Voting on all matt4ers shall be by voice vote or by show of hands unless any Member, prior to the voting on any matter, demands a written vote."

Is that demand for a written vote subject to a vote by the membership, or does that one person's request immediately mean that the wishes of one person are compelled to be followed by the entire membership (which at the upcoming meeting will probably be around 100 persons?

 

Looks like the latter to me.

 

It would seem prudent to either eliminate this rule or limit its applicability to certain types of motions.

[Gary Novosielski]

Looks like the latter to me.

 

It would seem prudent to either eliminate this rule or limit its applicability to certain types of motions.

 

Or buy lots of paper and pencils.